CategoryGeneral thoughts

I typically write posts beforehand and publish them later. The following was written around the 15th of July.

Over the last 7-8 years of investing I have outperformed the index by around 8-9% per annum. This has been mainly with a buy and hold type of investing and without any leverage, options or any other type of investments. However I have underperformed the index several times. I have underperformed around 2 out of 8 years of investing. If I reduce the time horizon, the number of times I would have underperformed the index will be even higher, maybe 30-40 % of time if I consider monthly buckets.

There is no fun in lagging behind the index. As I put it in another post, the benchmark I follow is the BSE index. My entry into active investing was also perfect. I started actively and seriously investing around dec 1999, right around the peak and promptly saw my portfolio cut by 25% in a years time.

I remember reading charlie munger and warren buffett say that temprament and ability to take losses without going nuts is crucial to investing. Most of us will have losses over our investing lifetime (diffcult for most to believe now as the indian market has been in a bull run from 2003).

I am still pained when I lag the index or when my stock goes down by 5-10%. However the advantage I have now is that I have experienced it several times and am able to be rational about it. When I was new to investing it was diffcult for me figure whether the market was being irrational or if I was missing something and my analysis was at fault.

For example I invested in concor in 2002 at around 250 –300 Rs/ share. The stock promptly dropped to around 180-190 Rs/ share. This company has a big competitive advantage to the point of a monoploy in container transport, high return on capital and was selling at around 5 times earnings then. When the stock dropped, I was not able to understand the reason behind it. I could see nothing wrong with the stock even after analysing it again. So I kept faith on my analysis and held on to the stock. The stock sells at around 2400 now. It is easy to look smart or stupid in retrospect, but I was not a 100% sure then.

The difference now is that I have more faith on my analysis and have more experience (and scars !!). I still get pained by losses, but am able to keep my emotions better under control.

01-August

I did not realise that I would be seeing the market crash so soon. Earlier I would read and try to check for the reasons behind the crash. Now, I usually don’t bother. The main reason is that my guess is as good as anyone else’s which in the end is a guess. However not bothering to find the reason does not mean ignoring the market crash. On the contrary, stocks which were cheap earlier are now cheaper and some stocks are getting more interesting. So if the price drops further, I see a good opportunity to pick up a few stocks or increase my investments in a few exisiting ones. Ofcourse the assumption here is that the underlying analysis is correct and nothing has changed from a fundamental standpoint.

The above viewpoint is ofcourse not conventional wisdom and is painful to execute especially when your holdings have already dipped below cost.

I started blogging in 2004 and had a blog on sify ( see here)

I was just browsing through my old blog to see what i had written then and see how my thinking has changed since then. I came accross this post which i had written then (more in jest than anything else). This was the time i think the market had just crashed.

Wednesday, May, 19th, 2004
trader or investor …who should i be ?
Let me see …..

trader
-> read the papers every day
-> watch cnbc full day for each development
-> sit in front of the trading screen watching the price ticker
-> try to see which party may get elected ( depend on the exit poll ??!!!)
-> have the courage to watch the market fall by 500+ points ( and go nearly bankrupt)
-> then watch the market go up by 200+ points ( and wonder what will happen next)
-> have the courage to lose big money or the courage to bet big
-> has a strong stomach for this kind of swings

investor
-> read annual report at leisure
-> analyse the company and industry over a long term
-> make a piddly 20 % p.a but not lose more that 5 %
-> less blood pressure
-> more time to watch other channels other than cnbc ( maybe discovery ??)

guess i am not cut out to be a trader …. dont have courage to bet big / lose big , like to sleep peacefully at night , politicians make my life miserable enough …dont want them bankrupt me …naah …not for a lazy guy like me

Prem sagar had a poll running on his blog for the best indian financial blogger and published the results recently.

Good to know that there at least 30 folks who find the blog worth reading 🙂

I have recieved Prof Bakshi’s interview via email. However i have yet to write to him and get his approval to forward the interview. In the meantime i have recieved a huge number of requests for forwarding the interview. I will try to email to all who have requested it (if prof bakshi is fine with it) , but please bear with me as the number of requests is huge.

I also recieve personal emails several times. I have attempted to answer them but i am not able to do justice to all of them due to personal time constraints. Hope those of you who do not hear me, will understand that i am time constrained and hence may not be able to reply some times. Leaving a comment would be a good idea in such a case. Some other reader on the blog may be able to respond to your query equally well.

Finally if you wish to subscribe to the blog via email , please enter your email id above the blog archives. You will recieve an email update whenever i post a new post.

Please feel free to leave a comment on how to improve the blog further and make it more useful.

I got the following comment from ranjit and gave the response below

Hi Rohit,
Today RBI has increased repo & CRR again. Please can you give me your historical perspective on these high interest rates and also what would you do in such situations, would you move into FD’s for some time or would you stay invested fully.

hi ranjit
my personal experience with interest rates has been from 95 onwards when i saw the rates move to 15% and since then it has been a downwards movement.my stock market positions are not based entirely on interest rates (at least not in the past). if i find a compelling buy, i go ahead with it if the expected returns are good.since 2003 i have moved into floating rate funds and plan to continue . floating rate funds are more tax efficient than FD’s and far more liquid , although absolute returns are less

In addition I plan to do the following

1. continue with a laddered approach to fixed deposit investing. What I mean by laddered approach is that I would be investing in FD’s over the next few months across the most attractive maturities. Currently the 1yr+16 day duration seems to be most attractive to me (the 2yr + 16 days gives 0.25 % more , but is not attractive for the extra duration). In addition, I do not plan to put all my funds into FD’s as one go as I do not have an idea how interest rates will move in the next 6 months. I expect them to stay as is or harden a bit, but frankly your guess is as good as mine. So my fixed income investing will be spaced out over the next few months.

2. Continue with floating rate funds which are more tax efficient than FD’s and far more liquid. The absolute returns are low, but they can serve as a good place to park extra funds

3.The bar for the stock market investing is now higher. I generally use a discount rate of 11-13% . I do not plan to revise it.

4. FD’s and fixed income mutual funds have now started to become a viable alternative to investing in index funds. I am not too keen on the index till the index drops by another 20% or remains flat while earnings catch up.

5. Finally, bad time to take any kind of loans – housing or otherwise.

See here for an earlier post on the same topic

I came across this article on the blog galatime. It’s titled ‘The effort effect’. The article resonated strongly with me. I think the power of mindset mentioned in the article is extremely crucial if one is to become a good investor.

The growth mindset (see diagram here) mentioned in this article is crucial to become a good if not a great investor. In comparison a fixed mindset (which a lot of us see around us) leads to poor performance in the long run. The key points of the growth mindset in terms of challenges, obstacles, effort, criticism and success of others are extremely relevant for an investor. As an investor one has to learn how to deal with new challenges and obstacles (the market and businesses around us are constantly changing). Effort is crucial in terms of a desire to constantly learn and improve oneself. Self criticism and an honest one is crucial too. One should be able to accept mistakes and learn from them and then move on. Finally I look at the other successful investors and try to learn from them.

The attitude referred to in the article is relevant to us not only as investors, but is important in other walks of life too.

In addition I found another link on the same blog on the mark of greatness. I found a similar article on greatness in fortune some time back (see link). The article in fortune mentions the following
Reinforcing that no-free-lunch finding is vast evidence that even the most accomplished people need around ten years of hard work before becoming world-class, a pattern so well established researchers call it the ten-year rule.

I have read in some other articles that 10 year or 10,000 hours of work is essential to achieve proficiency in a field. All the above research encourages me to keep working hard on becoming a better investor. Even if I don’t become a great or super investor, if I keep working at it, I will defintely be a better investor. My definition of a good investor is one who can beat the market by 5-10% points over a ten year period. I have done that for the last 6 years. I definitely plan to continue working on extending this performance.

update : 03/23

see here for an earlier post on the same topic

The RBI has just raised the CRR by another .5 %. This with inflation at 6.5%, although I feel this inflation is understated as the government’s basket of goods really not reflect an average middle class’s consumption profile. Rentals, education and health care alone are inflating in double digits.

I have never had any specific views on interest rates or inflation. I try not to base my investment plans on any predictions of inflation or interest rates. However that does not mean I don’t to react to it. In the past I have taken the following actions

In 2000-2001, I invested in fixed income debt funds. As the rates fell, the appreciation in these funds was substantial.

In 2003 when the interest rates were at an all time low, I moved my fixed income investments into floating rate funds and went long on by housing debt (see my thoughts on it here)

With rates hovering in 9-10 %, I have started looking at the option of moving out of floating rate funds into fixed income debt funds of average maturity (4-6 years duration). I have not made up my mind yet on it. I may wait for a couple of months more as I feel that the interest rates may rise a bit further. I am not sure about it and do not have specific views on it, but would wait and watch and react opportunistically to it.

As far as the stock market is concerned, I have been finding a few interesting opportunities such as indraprastha gas which I will explore further in a future post.

Additional comments – 15-Feb

Found this article on GEF (morgan stanley ‘s global economic forum)

http://www.morganstanley.com/views/gef/archive/2007/20070214-Wed.html#anchor4403

Following comments are worth noting

Excess liquidity conditions in late 2003 and 2004 resulted in banks searching for yield and charging negligible risk premiums for loan assets with inherently higher risks. Just about 12 months ago, banks were making little distinction between pricing credit risk for various types of loan assets. Almost all loans were being priced in a very narrow range of around 7.5-8%, which was very similar to the 10-year bond yields then. Indeed, banks’ lending behavior implied that the risk of lending to a low-income-bracket borrower (for whom there is little credit history available) for the purchase of a two-wheeler was not meaningfully different from the risk of investing in government bonds.

If the past two months’ average credit growth of 30% and deposit growth of 22.5% are maintained, the banking sector SLR ratio will reach its maximum limit of 25% by March 2007.

I have been noticing in the past few weeks that interest rates have started hardening. I do not have the exact figures, but it seems that the rates for housing loans have started approaching double digits now.

I wrote a post on interest rates a year back (see here). Back in 2003-2004 the rates were at an all time low (as low as 7.5% fixed and 7.25 % variable). However everyone looking at the immediate past, were prediciting further drops (what else would explain almost everyone’s preference for variable rate loans?). I almost got into an argument with the loan officer in getting a fixed rate loan (the loan officer kept telling me that I was making a big mistake).

My logic in working out a rough pricing level for loans was detailed here. General extremes in valuations, whether stock or interest rates are easier to spot (although I cannot predict them). However I do not know if the rates are high now, will rise or fall in the future. What I feel strongly is that any rate lower than 8% is good and should be locked in via a fixed rate loan.

There are a few new conventional ideas now prevalent such as

– real estate is great investment at any price and will rise 20-30 % per annum due to the extreme shortage of real estate in india (for better idea of real estate bubbles, read about the 90’s real estate bubble in japan)
– Indian economy has entered a new era and stocks are worth more now. Every drop in the market as a result presents a new opportunity to buy

I don’t claim that I know any better on the above two new convential ideas in vogue currently. I am however unwilling to pay for the bright and shiny new future in these investment classes (stocks and real estate)